Berlin Starting Sunday, Emmanuel Macron will be the first French President to pay an official state visit to Germany in 23 years. Macron has been to Germany several times before, but so far not in the form of a state visit with all the honors of protocol. The visit is intended to improve the tense Franco-German relations.
In an interview with the Handelsblatt, State Secretary Laurence Boone, who is responsible for European affairs, explains what the French government hopes to gain from the visit, how Paris intends to convince Berlin that the EU should expand eastwards more quickly, and why the Germans are reluctant to criticize the planned EU reform -Debt rules are wrong.
Ms. Boone, what do you expect from Emmanuel Macron’s visit to Germany?
The visit underscores the fact that almost 80 years after the end of World War II, Franco-German friendship remains more than ever a pillar of the EU. It is important to emphasize this at a time when we have a war on our borders and to send a message of indestructible unity for Europe.
In addition to Macron’s visit, a joint meeting between the two governments is also planned for autumn. Doesn’t all this symbolism show that the Franco-German relationship is in a serious crisis?
The relationship is not in crisis. And symbolism is important to mark our friendship and send such signals to the public.
But the disagreements between France and Germany on finance, defense or energy policies are hard to miss…
Of course we have a different culture, a different past. But that has never prevented us from making a strong contribution to EU integration. Look at the progress we’ve made on defense policy since last October. In energy policy we have the same goal, namely decarbonisation, even if we do not start from the same starting point; we also agreed on a lot of lyrics last winter. Catherine Colonna and Annalena Baerbock’s joint visit to Ethiopia is a perfect example of how intensive Franco-German relations are.
Germany and France also have different views on the eastward enlargement of the EU. How did the change of heart in Paris come about?
The world has changed, war is back on the continent and tensions linger. Either the Eastern European candidate countries will join us, or they will distance themselves from us and turn to influences that are not particularly friendly to the EU. That is why we are counting on this round of enlargement, which started more than a year ago, and it is of strategic importance.
And how do you convince Mr. Scholz?
We want to learn the lessons from the last EU enlargement. The candidate countries must reform themselves, this is crucial for them and for us. But we also have to help them, which is what some Scandinavian countries did, for example, with the Baltic countries during the last enlargement, to speed up and strengthen reforms. The addition of countries like Ukraine to the EU will mean a big change for both the EU and the countries that join us. And we have to prepare for that.
But doesn’t the EU have to reform before it can expand?
That goes hand in hand. We will not have an enlarged EU that looks like the EU-27 that we have today. Politics, budget and administration must be revised.
Chancellor Scholz’s speech to the EU Parliament in Strasbourg was recently interpreted as criticism of Macron’s call for the EU to become a kind of third world power. Did you understand his speech that way?
I would leave that to the people who interpret them. What we want is to make the EU a global geopolitical power. We realize that if we are to have such power, we must be stronger than just one country, and we can only achieve that as an EU region.
The Federal Chancellor gave a widely acclaimed speech in Strasbourg.
(Photo: dpa)
Let me tell you very clearly that in the EU we have 440 million people with a GDP per capita of over EUR 25,000. We are the first trade bloc in the world, the first for foreign investment. We have the means to be that power.
Should EU member states introduce new tools like outbound investment screening to better protect their own economies from Chinese influence?
Economic security should not be reduced to these kinds of things. It’s about coordinating trade and foreign policy, it’s about securing our internal market, and it’s about reciprocity.
Will the US push France and Germany to go further on China policy?
No, I don’t see that. We say China is a partner, a competitor and a systemic rival. Our dependencies have increased, so we want to defuse and strengthen our supply chains. Derisking is not against China, it is a sovereignty issue.
France does not want to explicitly target China with a de-risking strategy, says Boone.
(Photo: via REUTERS)
In Germany we are having a debate about subsidies for Intel, which receives around ten billion euros in subsidies for settling here. Are we already in a subsidy race with China and the US?
You shouldn’t see it that way. If the conditions offered in Europe are comparable to those in the US, then we have an interest in having the companies in Europe. Both in terms of jobs and technology. And also because a job in industry usually goes hand in hand with three, four or five other jobs in the service sector.
But where is the red line in your eyes?
Chips are such an important strategic sector to everything we do that we need to secure those investments. They give us a competitive advantage or are the key to supply chain resilience. We also need a sovereign cloud; the alternative is a cloud from a third country that may have the authority to see our data.
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A few months ago, the French government proposed fixed production targets for certain goods in a paper. In Germany, many people thought, oh, typically French planning.
But it is not. We don’t want to say you have to produce three cubic meters of chips, we want to set ambitious goals so that people invest.
Macron wants to encourage the Europeans to develop their own weapon systems. Germany generally relies on buying standard products from the US. a mistake?
It is true that Europe has to catch up in the production of weapons. Do we want to be completely dependent on third countries for equipment? I do not believe that. Do we have everything in stock at the moment? No. So what we need to do is invest as Europeans to develop the European defense industry. We have all the expertise and skills in Europe to produce more.
We’ve been talking about a European defense policy for 15 years and nothing has really happened.
That is not true. And the circumstances are different. I mean, nobody would have considered a Europe of Defense a few years ago. That changed dramatically with Russia’s aggression: look at the increase in defense spending. We’re catching up, and fast. But we definitely have to get faster and stronger.
In the debate about the EU fiscal rules, France and Germany have different opinions. What will a reform look like in the end?
The reform is necessary to allow Member States to make strategic investments while ensuring sound public finances. The Commission’s proposal is based on these principles. If you have to make public savings, you have to take the population with you. The aim of this proposal is to strengthen the sense of ownership of the individual countries in Europe. That’s super important.
German Finance Minister Lindner warns that compliance with the debt rules should not be a matter for negotiation between the Member States and the Commission.
But it’s not about negotiations. It is about finding the best way for public finances to move towards sustainable public finances, which also depend on our ability to invest and grow. We have seen that fixed rules and targets have not led to all of these targets in the past. So let’s correct the rules now and make sure that ownership is strengthened and the rules are more fit for purpose.
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